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Thread: You've Unbanned Me. A goodbye.

  1. #41
    Äh... that so many lies and broken promises would follow, nobody (except Atari) could know. No review could warn me. I loved the RCT Series and thout Atari did a good Job on RTC1-3. So they will of course fix RCTW. Yes... maybe my fault to trust. But this makes it nothing better how Atari handled the whole project. Maybe it's my fault that I bought the expensive Deluxe Version instead of something cheaper for the start. That still makes it not ok how Atari is acting. I don't trust blindly, I trusted in the RCT Franchise.
    I should take the responsibillitys but... Atari not for them? When I got Saywer right it is exactly that what he wants from Atari. And you don't see why...

    I'm out of here.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanguis View Post
    Äh... that so many lies and broken promises would follow, nobody (except Atari) could know. No review could warn me. I loved the RCT Series and thout Atari did a good Job on RTC1-3. So they will of course fix RCTW. Yes... maybe my fault to trust. But this makes it nothing better how Atari handled the whole project. Maybe it's my fault that I bought the expensive Deluxe Version instead of something cheaper for the start. That still makes it not ok how Atari is acting. I don't trust blindly, I trusted in the RCT Franchise.
    I should take the responsibillitys but... Atari not for them? When I got Saywer right it is exactly that what he wants from Atari. And you don't see why...

    I'm out of here.
    "I should take the responsibillitys but... Atari not for them? When I got Saywer right it is exactly that what he wants from Atari. And you don't see why..."

    Think about it, if I went to steam right now and bought something like No Mans Sky despite the negative press and reviews it has gotten then acted indignant about it when it turns out to be a boring rubbish game would I not look a bit daft asking Hello Games for an apology?

    Honestly I just don't feel entitled to an apology every time I personally make a bad purchase decision, perhaps I'm weird?

    As for the overall thread, no I don't feel like every company who has made a bad game needs to apologise, god if that was the way the world worked everyone would spend their entire lives apologising! Sure, Atari/Nvizzio made a bad game riddled with poor decisions, broken promises and overhype that disappointed many people, so have thousands of other companies and guess what, none of them are going to apologize for it. I don't personally feel entitled to an apology from either Atari, Nvizzio, Frontier, Hello Games or anyone that promised big and delivered short. I blame myself and myself only for buying those games and then wasting my money. What would an apology change anyway? Atari "We're sorry" fans "Yeah well up yours, we're off to play PC" At the end of the day talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words.

    Take care!

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
    Hello.

    I just want to say a few final words to you before I disappear from here. You don't need to block me again with your absolutely pathetic, childish ways because I will not be returning.

    Banning me without reason is a joke. Look at my sign up date and be sure to know I've been here since the start. I posted a link to the recent news story of you getting sued, no sarcastic comment or anything as stupid as that, but you removed it and banned it. Do you think people won't know. It's everywhere by the way and it's a good thing people are aware of what has happened, so removing my post about it only made people more aware because I posted it on the Facebook page I co-own. A page with a real community and not a few people posting a little bit. Almost 6 thousand fans strong of the genre it is very used. All of the people there were made aware of the quick removal of the post and know that I wasn't the only one to be banned.

    You'll remove this post, of course you will but don't worry. It's going on the page to show people. Deleting it will save you from your 10 strong community I'm sure.

    I am appalled by what you have done to RollerCoaster Tycoon. You should be ashamed of the way it's been handled. The game was getting better and you still managed to ruin it. I feel sorry for your players. The issue here isn't even that you made a slightly poor game. It's the way it's been handled. It's the lies, the false promises and the way you react to the fans. The amount of chances you have had is amazing and people still come to to you in hope but they are running thin now, I'm sure.

    A simple apology would go a long way to your fans.
    Totally disgusting Atari, just when I thought you couldn't get any lower. The way you've treated fans of the franchise is beyond belief. I've played RCTW and it's terrible. You must know this, you cannot say in all honesty that it's any where near a finished game. It's barely been started. Rather than admit to your errors and try to fix it, you instead blame the fans, anyone that didn't completely enjoy your overpriced demo is a troll. Wow. Really? The thousands of bad reviews I've read amounts to a whole lot of trolls, and you imply that all those thousands of trolls all paid for the game just so they could post a negative review? I've played it, and the bad reviews were all too kind. I didn't write one myself, because I was too lost for words, (PG words at any rate)

    I could not believe what I was reading in your interview when you blamed 'trolls' for your failure to make a playable game. Now you've started banning people for not loving it? Do you want a forum full of liars? I usually make it a point not to insult devs, I know how hard the industry is and how much work it entails, but you guys are really pushing it, its not just the awful game but your behaviour after it, the way you treat your fans, the way you refuse to listen to them, the way you ban them. These guys have done nothing wrong. At the very least you owe them an apology and a refund.

    It's not your fans fault that Frontier is suing you. You owe them 2.2 million, of course they're gonna sue you! You can't blame them, and you can't blame the fans. That's your own fault.

    You should count yourselves lucky you're not up for attempted murder - you nearly killed the whole franchise, thank god Frontier were around to save it.

    .... Deleting it will save you from your 10 strong community I'm sure.
    Make that 9 - my friend deleted his copy.

    You can ban me now, I'm off to play Planet Coaster, Your 9 remaining fans should do the same.
    Last edited by Sherrie; 01-05-2017 at 12:54 AM.

  4. #44
    I'm inclined to agree with Creeky here. I feel like an apology, no matter how sincere it is, won't make much of a difference. It's too little too late for one anyway. Without a doubt, the senseless bans and the way the game has been handled is unforgivable, but we'll still be stuck with a mediocre game. As Creeky put it, "At the end of the day talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words." Until they start doing something about this entire mess like fixing the freaking Troika animation, they can apologize all they want and it won't mean a damn thing. With all the chances they've been given and still managing to mess it up, I cannot see them learning from their mistakes at all.

    This might be a little off-topic. I remember this thread where RCTSupport answered a question about Dark rides with a questionable response, and shortly apologized saying they're still here and there will be more to come. That was back in November and they proceeded to disappear. In the end, apologizing didn't change anything as we still don't have dark rides, something that was planned long ago. All we were left with was someone (potentially a developer) who doesn't even know what a dark ride is. There was also multiple apologies regarding the boxed copies with the small Early Access print, yet nothing was done about it.

    I might be slightly misunderstanding the topic, but the way I see it, apologizing won't do anything at this point. Let's just see how things unfold after this lawsuit ends.

  5. #45
    Every time I think this game and Atari should be forgotten and left in the past they always do something to grab my attention again. I'm not saying an apology is in order (even though it is). I would at least like to have some comment of any form from Atari about this entire mess. Instead they probably spent all day today and will spend all day tomorrow sitting around a table discussing how to deal with this nightmare that is unfolding before them.

  6. #46
    Replying to Creeky's reply here, because while I agree with him on the whole, I think you're giving Atari too much credit and I hope to set the record straight.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - Atari has switched developers while leaving people in the dark on their reasons for it, even sweeping a lawsuit of their former developer under the rug. I won't believe they parted ways with Pipeworks on a good basis, but regardless, it's a bad sign when a game has gone through this many developers while retaining seemingly none of its original assets. If you can give me a clear, coherent statement from Atari on what exactly happened between the two parties, I would love to see it.

    No one had put money into the game at this point so while it was a shambles for Atari it didn't really impact us as customers save perhaps for a delayed launch
    But people did put money into the game. When the beta weekend was released, Atari said to release the full game shortly thereafter, and people had to purchase the game to get access to the beta and the eventual release. Players were promised a release of the game weeks after this purchase, but it was delayed for months, and eventually the 'release' came in an Early Access long after the launch of the full game was supposed to have taken place. I don't mind delays; the problem is that Atari should've delayed the game much earlier knowing how unfinished it was at that point, yet decided to announce nothing until just before release when a beta weekend revealed to everyone, who had by then already purchased the game, how bad it was.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - Atari willingly announced a release date for a game they knew they would not be able to finish by that time by far, and even now, over a year since the game was supposed to be released, it is still not finished. Atari knew the game wouldn't be done by the time they were claiming to

    How many companies over the years have botched a release date this is hardly unheard of in gaming.
    Again, the problem is not that the release date was pushed back - the problem is that Atari held on to a release date of which they knew they could never reach it, yet decided to tell no one about this until it was too late and many already got the game. The original release date could never, ever have delivered a full game, as we know in hindsight the game would suddenly. be in 'Early Access' many months after. Interestingly, this Early Access status was handily used to dodge criticism as the game's development was in 'an early stage' - how is a game's development in an early stage if it was extremely close to be released as a full game many months prior?. Atari was trying to release an early build as a full game from the start, only cutting the plan due to the negative reception of the beta. That's very different from extending a release date to finalize a game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - Atari has banned many constructive members and removed many posts from its forums simply for criticizing the game and the company.

    They have, but in a lot of those threads that were locked there were people being passive aggressive/abusive. I don't buy into the rubbish spouted in the interview about trolling ruining the game sure, but I'm sorry, I did see a lot of it here and in the threads that were locked. Name any moderated game forum that would tolerate that?
    I understand that, and it provides a difficult situations for moderators for sure. Users that don't comply with the rules should definitely be banned; the issue is that I have a bad feeling about the way that anyone who has been negative about the game has been treated. When so many people criticizing the game are silenced, yet those who openly praise the game are not met with the same repurcussions, I can't help but feel like that's suspicious. Not to mention the times when any PR disaster took place and mods started agressively removing threads that mentioned anything shedding Atari in a negative light. Of course, I have no proof of this, as all these things have been removed now - but the RCTW thread on Shyguysworld and especially the Planet Coaster forums shows the long history of this.

    And as a sidenote, no matter how rudely and aggressibely criticism is worded, it's consumer criticism regardless and should be taken seriously for that. When this many people are angry about your product, I doubt it's the people's fault - so don't blame them, and don't ignore their complaints.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - Atari willingly put an unfinished game on physical shelves with only a small note of the EA state on the back.

    I totally agree with you that this is a shameful thing to do, I'm honestly surprised that it was even legal! My suggestion to anyone who is duped by this in the future (should anyone ever decide to pull these tricks again) would be to seek a refund from the retailer and to kick up as much as a fuss as possible.
    Good point. And share it around as much as possible, I remember pictures of angry customers were all over the internet - at least wherever I go - when that happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - Atari has outright promised rides that never made it into the game (what happened to the dark ride support that was once hailed?).

    "Our planned feature list is HUGE!" There is a difference between planned and definite/confirmed features. They're allegedly going to release some of the rides in the future and sure I don't believe them either but again is this such a new thing for games companies?
    Fair enough, I do think they could've been more conservative with taking features onto this 'planned' list. I assumed that their feasability was considered in putting it on this list, but to me it seems more like they just put anything that was often requested on the list to appease the fans. For a lot of them, the 'planned' features were seen as confirmed features, and if this is not the case, I think Atari should've made this more clear. Instead, they seemed to take anything up as 'sure we'll do that' without thinking about it, a bit like No Man's Sky I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - Atari presented its game as an AAA title when it should be clear to anyone that Atari is miles from being an AAA company at this point. It doesn't have the budget, staff or any other resources to call itself that.

    Companies have a habit of overselling their product in an attempt to get your cash. This to me seems like a non issue, they were hardly going to market the game as being a low budget shoddy mess were they? Just like Frontier weren't going to sell the PC management as a dull micromanagement experience. Is 'AAA' a protect term or something because people seem to get hung up on this?
    I agree that it's not a key point, but I think it's more than the common overselling a game. Frontier didn't call Planet Coaster an AAA game, and they have more resources than RCTW. The issue I have with the tag is that it was seemingly carelessly thrown around to cover up the game's shovelware status and make it more appealing, without thinking of the consequences, namely that AAA implies everything that's simply not true for RCTW. Apart from having a publisher, I guess, but not even the earlier RCT games are considered AAA. Hell, the series is indie at its roots. It's as if a small studio launched a trailer for their low-budget movie and called it a Hollywood blockbuster - it's careless to me, almost laughable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    - aaaand Atari has called fans of its own game 'trolls'.

    That's because they're a laughable company who you shouldn't buy games from
    I've had my share of laughter over this game for the past two years, but the amount of unknowing people that bought this game because they recognized the name is pretty tragic. Hey, it may not even be the exact company, just the name that gets bought by another group of interest every few years. Seems like ever since it ripped off Pong and nearly crashed the market with Pacman and E.T., any company with the name Atari has banked off of others' IPs and concepts to shove games into people's laps. And with a business model that includes 'capitalizing on IPs' and contracting low-budget studios to do so, I think they're still well at it. The problem is spreading the message, I suppose.

    Edit: btw, I'm glad to at least have a discussion on a good level here - I'm very afraid of the echo chambers of angriness that most other places of RCTW discussion have become. I won't disagree with their sentiments, but any conversation too often dissolves into 'Atari sucks' circlejerking and personal attacks on fans of the game, and I'm glad that's not happening here, even if we do agree.

    Also, I don't think an apology would help at all for the game either, but PR wise, I can't fathom why they haven't given one yet. At least, I think most other companies would've done so at this point already to control the damage somewhat - calling people 'trolls' has clearly only made things worse.
    Last edited by Silvarret; 01-05-2017 at 05:10 AM.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creeky View Post
    Honestly I just don't feel entitled to an apology every time I personally make a bad purchase decision, perhaps I'm weird?
    I think Sawyer's post was more to do with the way Atari are handling things, he wasn't demanding an apology, or saying that the community deserves one, or that he's entitled, simply that it an apology would go a long way with fans.


    And yea, you're weird :P xo

  8. #48
    Honestly, Ataris actions are totally indefensible at this point, and I don't understand how some people can still say an apology wouldn't be necessary. They have outright lied to every single early backer, and have treated the community as if we're to blame which isn't fair in the slightest.

  9. #49
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    -I love you honey bunny
    -I love you honey bunny!

    -EVERYBODY BE COOL, THIS IS A ROBBERY!

    This, again, is sad to see. I tought that people who play tycoon game where more intelligent than that, especially with past experience about the blackout years that followed RCT3 soak and wild. You (mostly)all knew Atari went bankrupted, and was sold, from the time it was dealing with RCT3.

    Now understand that the buyer's position is monetize as much as they can out of what they got(not much, actually!). Atari is just a brand, RCT is just a product and we(players)are simply customers, nothing different that any other buisness. Since when did a producer/seller cared for customers? The sole purpose of a buisness is NOT TO CARE, it is for making money(profits, if possible).


    Atari's name is already burned. Apologies will not change a thing at this point. Which take us out of the main question, what future is there for RCT franchise name and for RCTW in particular?

    Two future are possible:

    -Atari keeps on track, and RCT dies with them.
    -Atari sell RCT for a very cheap price to a real video game producer(NVIZZIO) and they do as fans want.

    NVIZZIO is not responsible for Atari's behavior in this matter, and not responsible for undelivered promises made by others. They are under contract and have legal obligations to fullfill what they agree upon, and not more. One of them thing is, of course very negative for the game, no public speaking about RCTW.

    I'd be really surprise if they would go down the third way, the one they (already)missed with RCTW production, keep the name and FINALY LISTEN TO US, and give us WHAT WE WANT in RCTW, to save the day. I do belive miracle are possible, especially when it just need a little GOODWILL to create one. Faith or belief is not necessary. I'd say WAKEUP to Atari's management, but this is useless.

    This franchise can still be saved, but not by it's actual owner, but rather by we, the fans. If we let it go on hate(which is already here) it will die with it.

    I sincerely tought better of this community, so intelligent and literate the people forming it are. It's is formidable to read all of you and think about so many facts you put down above, but cannot accept that so fine people hate RCTW(or NVIZZIO) for Atari's lies. Don't mix up things, please?

    Most of us, from RCT3 time, knew how Atari was acting. As for the new fans, a simple (big brother)google search would have informed anyone in a hurry about it. 10 minutes of reading would have teached anyone.

    Back to RCTW, I still think, based on fact, that it has solid foundation and it's quite possible to turn it into AAA game. With a little love from us, and of course, free hands to NVIZZIO to deliver, as we tycoons ask. Come on now people of the tycoon community, no one will make me belive that it's THAT BAD. Because it's not. RCTW has flaws, many missing features and a few bugs in animations or program, thats right, but the game has vastly improve since January 2016. Softwares can always be recoded and turn into better, it is only a question of goodwill(and money!) about it.

    Just remember Atari DOES NOT PRODUCE video games, they are just intellectual property holding and software distributor, which buisness has died with STEAM network buisness style and massive game download culture. So in the end, they have nothing, so why would they care? Buisness(cash!) have no honor or loyalty related to it.

    So everyone please stay calm, fasten your seatbelt, breathe through the oxygen mask in front of you. This is only buisness.

    Welcome to the Planet Earth, where everything has been monetized.
    Last edited by Abbittibbi; 01-05-2017 at 09:31 AM.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Silvarret View Post
    *Lastest Reply!*
    Without quibbling over semantics regarding a few small points I will say that overall we're on the same page. I suppose my original grievance with this thread is mostly related to what you have said in your edit:

    "Edit: btw, I'm glad to at least have a discussion on a good level here - I'm very afraid of the echo chambers of angriness that most other places of RCTW discussion have become. I won't disagree with their sentiments, but any conversation too often dissolves into 'Atari sucks' circlejerking and personal attacks on fans of the game, and I'm glad that's not happening here, even if we do agree."

    Sure, I also don't disagree with the sentiments and can appreciate and understand why people are upset. It's just I'm seeing the same people over and over posting the same stuff under the veil of 'caring' about this game so much. Much like Red was the only guilty man in Shawshank I feel I was the only member of this forum who didn't really care all that much about the outcome of this game, just being honest here! . I think the steam store page and media in general is now armed with enough in the way of reviews that people wanting to purchase this game are easily able to make an informed decision. I wish people were able to move on from the fiasco that was RCTW and let the small number of fans this game has enjoy their community without constantly being brow-beaten by the hordes of PC fanboys.

    I made the original post that I did because in part I'm a little miffed that every mistake Atari ever makes has to be scrutinised resulting in long drawn out threads full of gloating and boasting about how fantastic the competition is. And yet when the competition make a few of the same mistakes those same people who scalded Atari will happily excuse them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aaronroberts View Post
    And yea, you're weird :P xo
    This is one of the few times in my life where I'm glad to be the weird one.

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