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Thread: Regarding the Dev Stream Earlier

  1. #1

    Regarding the Dev Stream Earlier

    Intro:

    I think I speak for the community when I say that i'm really dissatisfied about the Dev Stream earlier today. This is topic not meant to attack the streamer in anyway but it's more about the content showed during the stream and the last 5 minutes. My idea now is to leave useful feedback behind while giving criticism in a good and respectful way towards the developers once more. It came to my attention that the developers seemed to be completely off when it came to community priorities wishes. It's a complete mess right now and I wanted to try to get give this a huge turn once more.

    As a small team of developers communication towards the loyal fan base is just something you can't ignore. And my personal belief is that when Sophie (aka Vanillepink) left, no one is taking the time to respond to questions inside the steam forums or right here. With exception of Nook. There is allot of hate going on right now towards all members of Nvizzio, and in some cases towards Nook. And this is something Atari have done to themselves for sure. This is getting a huge boost by the fact that the content we hoped for is not coming once we get out of EA. And who else to blame than the people on the front Nvizzio? Think about this line for a while.

    About the stream:

    One hour before the stream I tried to ask if there was any room for question, however I also noted that I wanted to wait a while before asking any of my questions in the Twitch chat. Perhaps some of hem where getting answered during the dev stream. I made clear once more that it was really hard to speak to a game developers through the forums and that they usually do not respond.

    While the stream was running it came to my attention that we didn't see anything we hoped for as community. Yet the developers claimed this was all done by community feedback. Okay the peeps got a upgrade! and yet they seemed off. Still a lot of work to animation and A.I wise. But for sure slight improvements were made so, +1 on the devs on that! The most things people liked to see where in fact where stability and performance improvements.

    Community Wanted:

    Game-breaking issues resolved or at-least improved, statement etc anything?

    - Performance improvements (example: once a park is getting over 1K peeps are not solved. Also depends on the size of the parks, and UGC used)

    Community gets:

    - New menu (Looks way better)
    - Better peeps (Still a lot of work to animation and A.I)
    - New Maps
    - Piece-by-Piece Builder (Awesome if we were able to use it in our bigger parks)
    - New Progression Mode! (Awesome unlock new stuff while learning to play)
    - Saved games from Early Access will not carry over to the full release version of RCTW

    What we should have upon release:

    - Playable game

    - Achievements working right
    - Performance (Decent FPS on all kinds of supported hardware)
    - Improved Keyboard shortcuts
    - Autosave
    - Tutorials (Detailed how coasters work etc)

    - Freeform Object placement, Full axis control, Fully Deformable Terrain, Build Underground, Freeform Cameras: Take a video at any angle; edit your park above, below, or next to a ride, Custom Music & Images.

    - Improved path system ( i.e. curved que paths, steps)


    Rides:

    - Transportation Rides (Got announced Early 2017)
    - Dark Ride (At Least something)
    - Water Ride (At Least one like “logs flume”?
    - Our beloved maze?
    - Gokarts
    - Mini golf
    - Bumper cars

    Others:

    - Dynamic Weather?
    - Improved forums, active moderators etc
    - Secret content
    - Park Awards (Like safest, cleanest park as in the classic games)
    - the ability to edit items sold at food stands
    - customizing ride colors (Flat Rides etc)

    - Friend’s Lists and Stat Comparisons: See what your Steam and Social friends are up to in their games from within yours! It’s easy to see someone’s latest coaster or when they last edited their park.

    -Visit a Friend: Check out a friend’s park with a simple click! Chat with them and give them suggestions on what to do next while you’re there.

    But the game stays in an unplayable state once getting out of EA. Unless you keep all things small and simple with not too much peeps. I get it not all on your list is easy to do and within a specific time range as you needed to start RCTW from scratch all over again. But try to communicate about them now and then.

    Five minutes before the end of the stream Kim rushed into the room announcing only 5 minutes were left, kinda worked Daisy out of the room ASAP. This was looking a bit weird on the stream, join the conversation but don't work someone out like that Or at-least give the streamer some time to announce it as even he was kinda surprised. I get it if this was not Kim’s intention. But that’s what it looked like. O hey feel free to extend the stream by another 5 minutes as-long it it keeps your players happy! Not a single question got answered today.

    I left an invitation out to the developers to see if they liked to do a small conversation with a selected group of players to give them truthful and useful feedback from some people with 100H+ gameplay time without trolling a chat/forum. I hope to hear anything back from my invitation I left, and I hope some of the hardcore community members would love to be a part of that. If you have anything to add feel free to. I keep updating this post daily.

    One simple question for you to make this topic the best yet:

    What do you as player expect from Atari/Nvizzio creations to do next?

    Best Regards,

    TerrorToetje, Secret member, Deathtome
    Last edited by TerrorToetje; 11-11-2016 at 11:29 PM.

  2. #2
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    What do you as player expect from Atari/Nvizzio creations to do next?
    Just do not release it in the current state. It has absolutely no chance in hell even living alongside PC and much less being able to compete.
    With current reviews there is no way they are going to get much sales with that 1 day headstart.
    What they should do is keep it in EA and start redoing all the flat ride animations, the core mechanics like pathfinding and actually add something that separates it from PC, as there is no way it can directly compete anyways.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by boxman View Post
    Just do not release it in the current state. It has absolutely no chance in hell even living alongside PC and much less being able to compete.
    With current reviews there is no way they are going to get much sales with that 1 day headstart.
    What they should do is keep it in EA and start redoing all the flat ride animations, the core mechanics like pathfinding and actually add something that separates it from PC, as there is no way it can directly compete anyways.
    Sales enough to keep them alive, Only the name will do the job for them even if the content is incomplete.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerrorToetje View Post

    What do you as player expect from Atari/Nvizzio creations to do next?
    To continue adding to the game, to add the things that the fans want, things like what they have made promises about, to go through the game and fix the things that need to be fix and re-design (Those so called Alpha features) and to do what the fans expect from a true rct game.

    I still stand by my statements and views, but I have also stated my mind that the game shouldn't be leaving Early Access based on so many missing features that I want and so many others want. Also you know those features that you promised.

  5. #5
    As a public relations expert and someone who has kept an open mind on RCTW, I think it is a terrible idea to release it in its current state. There are many problems with their announcement of releasing it one day before PC:

    1) The game is not finished. Content promised to be there won't be there. No transport rides. No dark rides. No water rides.
    2) By trying to "one-up" PC by releasing a day early, you lost a ton of respect. Instead of people talking about the release of RCTW, they are talking about what a childish and poor move it was. This took the wind out of your release of the game.
    3) By releasing it one day before PC, you are going to see a ton of YouTube "RCTW FINAL vs. PLANET COASTER FINAL" and guess what. People will be showing transport rides for PC and a blank map for RCTW. They'll show water rides on PC and a blank map for RCTW. They'll show dark rides and ride triggers for PC and a blank map for RCTW. You have invited a TON of negative publicity by your release date choice and what will be available in this "final" version.
    4) Had you finished the rides/elements needed for a real final version and released it in 2017 you would have had your own fanfare. It would have been RCTW day. You wouldn't have the wind knocked out of your sails.

    You really need a public relations expert guiding you on this journey.

    The stream was a disaster when compared to the "reveal" stream of PC. And that's because you didn't have a lot to show with the rush to get the game out one day before PC. Instead of really planning it out, setting up in a nice studio, having professional videos to share, etc. it looked rushed and unorganized. The theme park game groups on Facebook were making fun of it.

    Start putting the gamers first and not your competition with PC. Forget about PC and focus solely on RCTW and excellence within the game. Start embracing bloggers/streamers and treat them like royalty. There's so much you CAN do that you're NOT doing because your focus is in the wrong place.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerrorToetje View Post
    Sales enough to keep them alive, Only the name will do the job for them even if the content is incomplete.
    How much sales have they had since the bad steam reviews??? It has been flat at around 80-90k owners since the first days of EA, which means that people have been refunding the game in same rate as buying.
    Unless they find some way to wipe the reviews and history around this game there is no way it will do much better on release, as people will see the overwhelmingly negative reviews when buying it through steam like the majority will.
    On top of that the professional reviewers will completely rip apart this game as well.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by deathtome View Post
    To continue adding to the game, to add the things that the fans want, things like what they have made promises about, to go through the game and fix the things that need to be fix and re-design (Those so called Alpha features) and to do what the fans expect from a true rct game.

    I still stand by my statements and views, but I have also stated my mind that the game shouldn't be leaving Early Access based on so many missing features that I want and so many others want. Also you know those features that you promised.
    Are you finally starting to see what many of us have realized already?? Even though there probably have been a few trolls here, most of us just want the game to be as good as possible and meet at least the bare minimum of expectations. The reason for my negativity and I bet many others here is because I feel like I have een talking to a wall and have lost pretty much all hope, which is exactly opposite of hating.

    And that being said.. I just spent the last hour providing negative feedback to frontier as well. Even though I think it is a much better game, I am still not a frontier/PC fanboy and speak up if I feel like there are areas it fails to deliver.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by deathtome View Post
    I still stand by my statements and views.
    You have to understand this is their project both Atari's and Nvizzio's. Tho Atari most likely has more control and are always going to do what they think is best for them given the resources they have and the risk they can and are willing to take.

    It was and never will be our project we don't get to make that calls. If you think you can do better then go start a project and do so. Like I have said I am sorry that you don't enjoy it as it is. Some of us do. Could it be better? Yes, everything can be better in some shape way or forum. You have to remember that there are real people working on this, that think and feel like they are doing what is best. Being so negative and hurtful during any game's early access is kinda a unfair judgment.

    Please stay on topic!
    Last edited by deathtome; 11-12-2016 at 02:38 AM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by deathtome View Post
    You have to understand this is their project both Atari's and Nvizzio's. Tho Atari most likely has more control and are always going to do what they think is best for them given the resources they have and the risk they can and are willing to take.

    It was and never will be our project we don't get to make that calls. If you think you can do better then go start a project and do so. Like I have said I am sorry that you don't enjoy it as it is. Some of us do. Could it be better? Yes, everything can be better in some shape way or forum. You have to remember that there are real people working on this, that think and feel like they are doing what is best. Being so negative and hurtful during any game's early access is kinda a unfair judgment.
    Telling them how you feel about the game even when it is negative is exactly opposite of being "hurtful". You cannot expect change if you dont tell them what the problem is. If community had shut up back when they released the area52 trailer then situation would have been much worse than now. It is because of that negative criticism that they understood that they had to make changes. It also was the community that got them to consider EA in first place.

    If you are able for just one moment look past the UGC and imagine what this game has to offer if that feature never existed, then you should be able to see why so many people don't enjoy the game in the current state.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by boxman View Post
    Telling them how you feel about the game even when it is negative is exactly opposite of being "hurtful". You cannot expect change if you dont tell them what the problem is. If community had shut up back when they released the area52 trailer then situation would have been much worse than now. It is because of that negative criticism that they understood that they had to make changes. It also was the community that got them to consider EA in first place.

    If you are able for just one moment look past the UGC and imagine what this game has to offer if that feature never existed, then you should be able to see why so many people don't enjoy the game in the current state.
    Even without ugc the game is enjoyable. I don't use a quarter of the ugc on the work show as most of it is not worth using. One of the very first parks that I fully tricked out was a park that used zero ugc and I had a blast making that park. And the ugc is nowhere near as powerful it could be if they would take away some of the limits the ugc plug in has. So no the ugc is not the only thing that makes this game enjoyable to me.

    Please stay on topic.

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