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View Full Version : Addressing One of RTC 3's Biggest Logistical Problems



AtlantisAuthor
02-17-2015, 12:05 AM
I've noticed that players will be able to use splines to manipulate and build coasters in RCT World that far more accurately achieve their individual ambitions. That alone is a huge step above using only the palette of available track sections that RTC 3 gave you. But I hope that RTC World's use of splines goes beyond just that.

If I read correctly, RCT World's parks will still employ a grid to aid in placing rides, stands, and walkways. Such a system has served the series well in previous installments...until you do anything to the topography. Add a hill, dig a trench or canyon, create a lake, or do anything else within close proximity of existing pathways and suddenly you'd start getting those dreaded messages like "Peeps/Mechanics can't get to RideName1", because while the pathways are designed to stick to the grid, the incremental slopes created by making such terrain adjustments wreak havoc on them by disconnecting edges here and there. Who else besides me has spent a lot of time having to zoom in to tweak path edges manually, raise stands or platforms here or there, and fight the game's limitations in order to try to make the intended scenery work with the mechanical logistics?

Ah, and tunnels. So easy to envision, so difficult to actually implement, especially for walkways. Want to create a convincing cavern or other subterranean environment? No can do unless you like lots of blocky shapes. If only there was an engine or template which could automatically "paint" the inner surface of such an environment with not only color but the random stalagmite/stalactite, for examples, in a way akin to ModNation Racers' brushes?

This is still kind of an unanswered question for me: will RCT World's park pathways avoid suffering from the same grid-dependent limitations that tend to mess everything up when you change the altitude of nearby terrain or prevent you from creating tunnels and underwater passageways in RTC 3? It would truly be a game-changer to have them be able to adapt to other changes you make in real-time as opposed to the old "spend the next half hour fixing the mess".

Oh, and an "Undo" button to reverse the last thing you did/created would also help prevent a lot of frustrating mistakes, as well.

I realize that it's late in RCT World's development for the base game, but if these things aren't already implemented I hope they might be considered for a possible future patch/update. Any thoughts or insights the dev team can share would be greatly appreciated here. Thanks in advance.

darkhorizon
02-17-2015, 12:35 AM
Totally didn't know they were releasing a Roller Toaster Cycoon: World game too! Do you have a link?

khh0929
02-17-2015, 02:17 AM
?? They didn't releasing RCT:World. They just review their's game.
Here is the link for this substance : https://forum.rollercoastertycoon.com/showthread.php?1906-RollerCoaster-Tycoon-World-Production-Blog-Post-3

And, AtlantisAuthor, I'm afraid of the grid system. Because it is so bad. We can't make the curved road in RCT3 without Mods. Just one things of My hope is : Curved road!

And If developer's has the brain, they must be input "undo" function.

king_austin95
02-17-2015, 02:25 AM
Totally didn't know they were releasing a Roller Toaster Cycoon: World game too! Do you have a link?

lol. don't be mean.
it took me a while to get it.
i kept reading it normally instead of with the letters switched.... its weird how our brains do that :/

Menno
02-17-2015, 05:42 AM
The problem with RCT3 wasn't so much the grid as just that they didn't do the QA right. This was a big bug that should have been edited out either by not allowing the terrain tool to edit tiles that have been built on (the simple solution) or allow the paths to rise and fall with the terrain as they do in real life. The problem in RCT3 in short wasn't the grid it was bad design.
As for the undo button: it has been pretty much confirmed in another post by Matt I think.
Now as Beerwhiskers has said in another post the grid has something to do with pathfinding which would otherwise be near impossible in a game like RCT. (Yes Sim City has curved roads but they made sure everything is linked to a road so in effect the road itself has been made into the grid). However I do believe diagonal paths have been confirmed. Don't know about curved roads just yet.

AtlantisAuthor
02-17-2015, 05:49 AM
Oops. Sorry, mental typo there, guys. Yeah, I meant to say "RCT World", but I often get the "T" and "C" transposed because I'm thinking of the "C" in Tycoon, of all things (I visualize "Rollercoaster" as one word and the "C" in Tycoon as the first letter of a syllable, if that makes any sense at all; as king_austin95 said, it's indeed weird how our brains work on occasion). It's just one of those things that can happen with acronyms when you don't stop to really think about the letters/words involved (for me, at least).

Pandawan
02-17-2015, 07:54 AM
Yeah, A grid system isn't always that nice.
But if they already made the choise to do it like that, it would be too much work to edit it.

SparkyUK
02-17-2015, 08:51 AM
I've noticed that players will be able to use splines to manipulate and build coasters in RCT World that far more accurately achieve their individual ambitions. That alone is a huge step above using only the palette of available track sections that RTC 3 gave you. But I hope that RTC World's use of splines goes beyond just that.

If I read correctly, RCT World's parks will still employ a grid to aid in placing rides, stands, and walkways. Such a system has served the series well in previous installments...until you do anything to the topography. Add a hill, dig a trench or canyon, create a lake, or do anything else within close proximity of existing pathways and suddenly you'd start getting those dreaded messages like "Peeps/Mechanics can't get to RideName1", because while the pathways are designed to stick to the grid, the incremental slopes created by making such terrain adjustments wreak havoc on them by disconnecting edges here and there. Who else besides me has spent a lot of time having to zoom in to tweak path edges manually, raise stands or platforms here or there, and fight the game's limitations in order to try to make the intended scenery work with the mechanical logistics?

Ah, and tunnels. So easy to envision, so difficult to actually implement, especially for walkways. Want to create a convincing cavern or other subterranean environment? No can do unless you like lots of blocky shapes. If only there was an engine or template which could automatically "paint" the inner surface of such an environment with not only color but the random stalagmite/stalactite, for examples, in a way akin to ModNation Racers' brushes?

This is still kind of an unanswered question for me: will RCT World's park pathways avoid suffering from the same grid-dependent limitations that tend to mess everything up when you change the altitude of nearby terrain or prevent you from creating tunnels and underwater passageways in RTC 3? It would truly be a game-changer to have them be able to adapt to other changes you make in real-time as opposed to the old "spend the next half hour fixing the mess".

Oh, and an "Undo" button to reverse the last thing you did/created would also help prevent a lot of frustrating mistakes, as well.

I realize that it's late in RCT World's development for the base game, but if these things aren't already implemented I hope they might be considered for a possible future patch/update. Any thoughts or insights the dev team can share would be greatly appreciated here. Thanks in advance.

I totally get this. I loved RCT3 but it had many flaws, and your description covers a lot of them. I do remember once spending a long long time building a park and putting a lot of effort into it. Having forgotten I hadn't actually saved it (and I don't turn off my Mac much), I managed to ruin days of effort in one mouse click. By mistake, I managed to create a razor thin, but almost 1000m tall "mountain" which destroyed paths and other scenery objects and in fact totally ruined what I'd spent a long time theming. There's no undo button, and trying to put it back took a very long time to get right - resulting in having to delete a lot of stuff.

Also, the lighting, or fences along paths. It seems once the path object is down, there's not always the option to fence around it, and to have lighting there too. The object space is occupied and if there are objects in the surrounding tile frame, you weren't able to place anything additional down - so for some parks, it was fence, or lighting, not both.

I am thankful that this game is a development from scratch, and not an extension of the existing stack. Hopefully the developers will have played the old game to see how restrictive it was.